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1. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

    
   Well I know this isn't EXACTLY science, but its a theory
   
   Its a bit insane, and I have been as rational as possible, but this seems like a plausible theory that I have grown fond of recently
   
   "According to certain authors, intelligent extraterrestrial beings called ancient astronauts or ancient aliens have visited Earth, and this contact is connected with the origins or development of human cultures, technologies, and religions. A common variant of the idea include proposals that deities from most – if not all – religions are actually extraterrestrials, and their technologies were taken as evidence of their divine status."
   
   Now the main reason I find this plausible, Is the fact that so many isolated civilizations coincidently came up with many deities, some even similar.
   
   I can not explain it as well as Erich Von Daniken does in his books, but if you think about it, primitive people would have no other explanation for advanced technology.
   
   I read somewhere that during WW2, I think it was the Japanese that ended up flying their planes directly over an island populated by a completely isolated tribe. Turns out the natives saw divinity in these roaring beasts, and ended up buildings "statues" if you will, out of whatever wood/grass they could find, and spent a good amount of time, if not constantly since then, scanning the skies, waiting for the "gods" to return
   
   There are similar stories about coca cola bottles washing up on shores of islands filled with tribes
   
   So to me, it is completely plausible that if ET's ever came to earth, they were mistaken for gods
   
   In conclusion of that part, many books, texts, even cave drawings of deitys, perfectly describe what most people nowadays would call extra-terrestrials landing haha
   
   ---------------------
   Now for all this to happen, 'aliens' would have to exist
   
   Anyways, I feel like no one's going to read this, so I am gonna stop here, for it is late. I apologize for any grammatical or spelling mistakes I made :P
   
   DiscussAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
2. •  
     CommentAuthorProletariatTreeHuger
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

    

   Posted By: SgtVoodooSo to me, it is completely plausible that if ET's ever came to earth, they were mistaken for gods

   
   That is plausible, but what isn't is aliens visiting us in the first place.
3. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010 edited

    
   True. But look at humans now, we have hundreds of giant telescopes, radio telescopes, and various other instruments looking for life. We have also landed instruments on multiple planets/moons
   
   All there would need to be is a civilization slightly more advanced, and they probably would have found earth easy. Could have also been an accidental find.An atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
4. •  
     CommentAuthorProletariatTreeHuger
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

    
   I think you underestimate the sheer vastness of space. Hundreds of billions of planets around hundreds of billions of stars in this galaxy alone. Then the incredible distance between galaxies themselves. It's not just a matter of finding us, which is near impossible, but to actually get to us in a universe 30 billion light years across.
   It's wishful thinking.
5. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

    
   I completely agree
   
   But I completely disagree
   -----
   I am not underestimating the sheer vastness of space. That is how I am pretty much sure there is life somewhere else, and if there is, they're bloody far
   
   But there could always be a civilization with technology so advanced, and ways of transportation, that we couldn't even comprehend.
   
   We can't travel faster than light.. To our knowledge. Just like life can't exist without water.. To our knowledge
   
   Sure, its kind of stretching it. But thats why its called a theory
   
   Pretty much, yes space is vast. But why couldn't there be life somewhere that is advanced enough to detect us, and travel that MASSIVE distance with easeAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
6. •  
     CommentAuthorProletariatTreeHuger
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

    

   Posted By: SgtVoodooBut there could always be a civilization with technology so advanced, and ways of transportation, that we couldn't even comprehend.

   
   You can also say there COULD be a god. You can also say this entire universe is a hologram and we are but brains in jars.
   The point is not to come up with imaginative ideas and give them an air of probability simply because you can imagine it, but to ascertain if it happened or not. Sure solipsism COULD be true, and I am the only one living, everything including you is my mind. But is it actually true? Probably not.
   At the moment traveling faster than the speed of light appears to need infinite energy, which is nonsensical. There COULD be a way around that, but what evidence is there of that? An alien species COULD have figured out how, and found us, but what evidence is there of that?
   
   

   Posted By: SgtVoodooSure, its kind of stretching it. But thats why its called a theory

   
   Are you trying to equate this to a scientific theory?
7. •  
     CommentAuthorvenomfangx
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

    
   Archduke

   Posted By: SgtVoodooAccording to certain authors

   
   Erich von Däniken
   Däniken's run-ins with the law started at an early age. In the 1960s, while working in hotels and restaurants across Switzerland, he was convicted of fraud, serving a prison sentence for defrauding his boss at one hotel. In 1967, soon after Chariots of the Gods? was published he was arrested and charged by Interpol with fraud and tax evasion for non-payment of GB£7,000. During the investigation, authorities uncovered a large personal debt totaling about GB£350,000. Däniken was found guilty of embezzlement, and served more than three years in Swiss prisons. While in prison, he continued writing, and "Return of the Gods" was subsequently published.
   
   In my humble opinion extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence
   The evidence that Däniken has put forward to support his paleo-contact hypotheses can be categorized as follows:
   Artifacts have been found which are alleged to represent a higher technological knowledge than existed at the times when they were manufactured. Däniken maintains that these artifacts have been manufactured either by extraterrestrial visitors, or by humans who obtained the necessary knowledge from them. Such artifacts include the Antikythera mechanism, Stonehenge, the statues of Easter Island, and the Piri Reis map.
   In ancient art throughout the world, themes are observed which can be interpreted to illustrate astronauts, air and space vehicles, non-human but intelligent creatures, and artifacts of a high technology. Däniken also points out details that are similar in the art of unrelated cultures.
   Origins of religions might be a reaction to contact with an alien race by primitive humans. The humans considered the technology of the aliens to be supernatural and the aliens themselves to be gods. According to Däniken, the oral and literal traditions of most religions contain references to visitors from "stars" and vehicles traveling through air and space. These, he says, should be interpreted as literal descriptions which have changed during the passage of time and have become more obscure, rather than as symbolic or mythical fiction. One such is Ezekiel's revelation in the Old Testament, which he interprets as a detailed description of a landing spacecraft.
   
   I have read all his books but I thank wikipedia for providing me with the precis.
   
   yours
   VFXGénéralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
8. •  
     CommentAuthorvenomfangx
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010 edited

    
   Archduke

   Posted By: SgtVoodoo. But thats why its called a theory

   
   You are getting the word theory mixed up with a mere hunch. In science, theory means the highest proof or support possible.
   
   
   

   vƒ><

   Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
9. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
   • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

    
   Well I guess your right. I assumed that since I am the opposition of a group that believes in an magical omnipotent person, that I had as much freedom to stretch things :P
   
   The only evidence that an alien species have found us (I guess I shouldn't say "only")
   
   Are, every god written about(if you believe the ancient astronaut theory), possible abductions (I ain't talking about the rednecks talking about anal probes), countless sightings (some by entire cities), possible recoveries of crashed space ships, etc.
   
   So really there isn't any SOLID proof, but there is LOTS of maybes. Chances are ONE of those are legitimate
   -------
   The main evidence I see, is the fact that it is believed at all. Sure millions of people could have just made it up, and millions probably did. But SOMEWHERE there has to be truth
   
   Just like how somewhere behind the entire existence of 'gods', there has to be truth somewhere. Be it meteorite, aliens, or none of the above.An atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
10. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    The ancient astronaut theory is as much as a theory as the big bang "".
    
    
    VFX, There is a list of authors who have similar views to Erich Von Daniken. His books are just the only ones I've readAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
11. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: SgtVoodooThe ancient astronaut theory is as much as a theory as the big bang "".

    
    This is not quite true as I am involved at CERN and the Big Bang is a certain event. It is the conditions a few milliseconds after that event and the particles which are being determined at this second. If we fail to find the Higgs particle, this will mean a total re evaluation of everything we know: it is possible that string theory might hold more answers than the current mathematics and research has shown.Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
12. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: SgtVoodooVFX, There is a list of authors who have similar views to Erich Von Daniken. His books are just the only ones I've read

    
    I am glad you started this thread as it is a great topic. If you look down you might notice I started a thread on Area 51 and the ideas postulated by Captain Corso.
    by all means put in photos and things as it is interesting to reflect on. It is important to leave no stone unturned in the quest for knowledge.Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
13. •  
      CommentAuthorProletariatTreeHuger
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     

    Posted By: SgtVoodooThe main evidence I see, is the fact that it is believed at all.

    
    That is a rather fallacious statement. Why does something necessitate truth simply because people believe it? Are you forwarding the ontological proof for the existence of aliens now along with god?
14. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010 edited

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: ProletariatTreeHugerontological proof

    
    Is this of spatiotemporal contingent beings? I think PTH that what he is trying to say is that "where there is smoke there is fire". Please allow him to say what he has to say without rebuke. I find this rather interesting.Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
15. •  
      CommentAuthorProletariatTreeHuger
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010 edited

     
    I'm only stating what I find to be a problem in his reasoning, VFX. He is not prevented from saying it in any way, so there was no point for your response. Stay on topic.
16. •  
      CommentAuthorFackelDerAufklärung
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     

    Posted By: SgtVoodooWell I know this isn't EXACTLY science, but its a theory
    

    
    It's neither close to science nor is it a hypothesis. It is pure unscientific speculation.
    
    

    
    Its a bit insane, and I have been as rational as possible, but this seems like a plausible theory that I have grown fond of recently
    

    
    
    Grown fond of a speculation == BEWARE THE IRRATIONALITY
    
    

    
    "According to certain authors, intelligent extraterrestrial beings called ancient astronauts or ancient aliens have visited Earth, and this contact is connected with the origins or development of human cultures, technologies, and religions. A common variant of the idea include proposals that deities from most – if not all – religions are actually extraterrestrials, and their technologies were taken as evidence of their divine status."
    

    
    Yes. That could have happened. It is not necessary though. We can explain cultures, technology and religion without the help of alien. There is no need to assume their existence. Which doesn't mean they weren't involved, but I hope you get the idea.
    
    

    
    Now the main reason I find this plausible, Is the fact that so many isolated civilizations coincidently came up with many deities, some even similar.
    

    
    So? There is a limit to the bullshit people can make up. Of course there will be similarities.
    
    Have you ever wondered why the way dramas are written hasn't changed much since the Greek?
    

    
    I can not explain it as well as Erich Von Daniken
    

    
    Oh. That guy. I remember reading some of his books as a child. I am ashamed to admit that I bought many things he said at first. It took me some tome to realize just how full of shit he is. I cannot phrase it any other way.
    
    Erich von Däniken -- Criticism
    
    

    
    does in his books, but if you think about it, primitive people would have no other explanation for advanced technology.
    

    
    Yes. Many native tribes will jump to the conclusion "A wizard did it". How do aliens come into this play?
    
    

    
    I read somewhere that during WW2, I think it was the Japanese that ended up flying their planes directly over an island populated by a completely isolated tribe. Turns out the natives saw divinity in these roaring beasts, and ended up buildings "statues" if you will, out of whatever wood/grass they could find, and spent a good amount of time, if not constantly since then, scanning the skies, waiting for the "gods" to return
    

    
    Yes, but they built statues not! for aliens from outer space, but from cultural aliens from earth.
    

    
    There are similar stories about coca cola bottles washing up on shores of islands filled with tribes
    
    So to me, it is completely plausible that if ET's ever came to earth, they were mistaken for gods
    

    
    
    Yes, it is plausible to assume that aliens would have been mistaken for gods. But it is not plausible to assume that aliens actually visited this earth.
    
    

    
    In conclusion of that part, many books, texts, even cave drawings of deitys, perfectly describe what most people nowadays would call extra-terrestrials landing haha
    

    
    Show me.
    
    

    
    Now for all this to happen, 'aliens' would have to exist
    

    
    Yes. Now show me the evidence for that.
    
    

    
    Anyways, I feel like no one's going to read this, so I am gonna stop here,
    

    
    Insecure much? ;-)
    
    

    ---

    
    
    

    Posted By: SgtVoodoo
    So really there isn't any SOLID proof, but there is LOTS of maybes. Chances are ONE of those are legitimate
    

    
    Chances are NONE of those is legitimate.
    
    

    
    The main evidence I see, is the fact that it is believed at all.
    

    
    So Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, the tooth-fairy, and "true love" do all exist, because people believe in it? Really now?
    

    
    Sure millions of people could have just made it up, and millions probably did. But SOMEWHERE there has to be truth
    

    
    No, there is no necessity for there to has be truth.
    

    
    Just like how somewhere behind the entire existence of 'gods', there has to be truth somewhere. Be it meteorite, aliens, or none of the above.

    
    Again this strange necessity. Where do derive that from? Why does it "has to"?The fear of death arises from the false belief that in death there is awareness.
17. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: FackelDerAufklärungYes. Now show me the evidence for that.

    
    Of course he has found no evidence. The evidence is re examining the artefact's from the past and looking for another explanation than a primitive culture made them.
    You do not know the real story behind those trinkets but can only speculate.
    Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
18. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    VFX, Thanks for at least giving me a slight chance, I realize this stuff is pretty hard to believe, I am not saying its what happened, but its a theory that I am interested in. Yes I am 16, and yeh I am probably not as intelligent as you supreme beings :P
    
    Fackel, I am willing to talk about this, if you're willing not to attempt to make it as hard as possible
    
    All I am trying to say is, there is in pretty much every case, a spark of truth that starts the forest fire of insane claims and beliefs.
    
    Dragons for example. Yeah they're Fairy tales. But it is a fact that there are/were large birds and giant lizzards that most likely got over exaggerated and distorted
    
    Things get over exaggerated easily, but there has to be something to exaggerate
    
    I don't have any holy books or cave drawings sitting around my house, but if you would like to read through them all, I guarantee you'll find the "descriptions of what most people nowadays would call extra-terrestrials landing "
    
    You're asking for evidence of the impossible. Oh wait, I forgot about my spaceship, brb, gonna go check for aliens.
    
    If we exist, then life can "accidentally" come into existence. If life can accidentally come into existence, then chances are ONE of the uncountable amount of planets suitable for life(How do we know life NEEDS water anyways), has life on it
    
    I am off to bed, so I don't have time to pull out a book talking about the chances of life, but I will get back to you.
    ---
    You don't need to be so offensive about this, it is a discussion, I am not trying to force this on anyone hahaAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
19. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: SgtVoodooit is a discussion,

    
    Indeed and of course we can speak of the improbable, the possible and even a little magic.
    Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
20. •  
      CommentAuthorProletariatTreeHuger
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010 edited

     
    Hey Voodoo, the problem we have isn't about the possibility of life. Mathematically it's close to 100% chance of life existing on other planets. The problem is people thinking that life made it over to here. That's when the incredulity springs up.
21. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: ProletariatTreeHugerThe problem is people thinking that life made it over to here

    
    It is possible, but not probable.Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
22. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    How is it not probable?
    
    It is not probable for the human species to travel that far :P, so you just assume its not possible for any possible civilization? Even if its thousands of years aheadAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
23. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Archduke
    There is a barrier called the speed of light which is about 300 000kms^-1. The nearest star system to us Alpha Centauri is about 4.5 light years away but we cannot even get close to those speed and if we did relativistic effects would occur. You would increase in mass a trillion fold, your length would increase as well as experience time dilation. Go away for about a year at 99.9999999% of C and you would find on your return a million or so years have passed by. Wormholes and other dimensions may exist and are theoretical hypothesis but have not really been demonstrated. There is an issue with travelling to distant stars.Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
24. •  
      CommentAuthorFackelDerAufklärung
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     

    Posted By: SgtVoodooVFX, Thanks for at least giving me a slight chance, I realize this stuff is pretty hard to believe, I am not saying its what happened, but its atheorythat I am interested in. Yes I am 16, and yeh I am probably not as intelligent as you supreme beings :P
    

    
    Don't sell yourself short. You just have to realize that many theories and speculation that sound really neato don't have to be the case. I would love to live in a Star-Trek-like world with many humanoid aliens and the like, just for the interracial kink ;) Yet it doesn't change the fact that the alien-concept of Star Trek is utter bullshit. Utter. Bullshit. (I say this as a Trekkie, mind you.)
    
    

    
    Fackel, I am willing to talk about this, if you're willing not to attempt to make it as hard as possible
    

    
    I am not making it hard on purpose. It's just that you are arguing from a weak position which makes it relatively easy to debunk.
    

    
    All I am trying to say is, there is in pretty much every case, a spark of truth that starts the forest fire of insane claims and beliefs.
    

    
    And all I am saying is that this has not necessarily to be the case. Insane claims and beliefs really just can be the children of insanity and absurdity.
    

    Dragons for example. Yeah they're Fairy tales. But it is a fact that there are/were large birds and giant lizzards that most likely got over exaggerated and distorted
    

    
    So? In science fiction many animals serve as archetypes for aliens and other fantasy creatures. It proves that there are animals that inspired writers, not that those inspired-animals do really exist.
    

    
    Things get over exaggerated easily,but there has to be something to exaggerate
    

    
    Again, not necessarily. It just can be delusions, hallucinations, or imagination. There doesn't has to be some real entity that gets distorted. There of course can, but not necessarily so.
    

    
    I don't have any holy books or cave drawings sitting around my house,
    

    
    I peer-reviewed paper would suffice.
    

    
    but if you would like to read through them all, I guarantee you'll find the "descriptions of what most people nowadays would call extra-terrestrials landing "
    

    
    Anyway, just show me one of those photos, I am sure there are such images on the interwebs somewhere.
    

    
    If we exist, then life can "accidentally" come into existence. If life can accidentally come into existence, then chances are ONE of the uncountable amount of planets suitable for life(How do we know life NEEDS water anyways), has life on it
    

    
    When we know that we exist, we now that the chance of life emerging on earth(!) are 100%. We do not know how many earthlike planets there are, but we even know that the sun-like solar-system are the norm. Most star systems are bi-star-systems, very unsuitable for life.
    
    We don't know that life needs water, yet it is the only place we know life emerged, so that's what we are looking for then.
    
    Even if we assume that there are billion of planets were life could emerge, it doesn't mean it will emerge. (Only because it's possible doesn't mean it will happen!)
    
    Even if we assume that life emerges on million of planets, there is no guarantee that intelligent life will evolve. (Mind you, we humans would not exist if it weren't for a comet to hit earth, putting an end to the dominant but stupid dinosaurs.)
    
    Even if we assume, that intelligent life emerged on thousands of planets, there is no need to assume that they will develop the technical needed for space travel. (We are far, far away from space travel. The best we can do is put up satellites; at least those have some practical use. And mind you that we discovered the H-bomb first and that mutually assured self-destructed was a real possibility for quite a few decades.)
    
    And even if we assume that hundreds of civilization conquered space travel, there is no indication whatsoever to assume that they have reached this planet. The amount of space they had to travel through is insanely huge. (Again, I cannot stress how huge, bu yeah, it's huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge.)
    
    

    
    You don't need to be so offensive about this, it is a discussion, I am not trying to force this on anyone
    

    
    It was not my aim to be offensive, I just want to make you realize that people like Däniken cannot be trusted. Go read some Carl Sagan instead :)The fear of death arises from the false belief that in death there is awareness.
25. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Just because someone commits minor crimes, (Its not like he murdered someone), doesn't mean he doesn't have a brain :P
    
    Well if you've read the books, then there not much of a point in me posting the proof, but heres some (Its not solid, in fact I'll admit, its really tipsy. But you never know)
    
    Gotta look closely at this one
    
    
    Yeah could be ceremonial
    
    
    I am not sure this ones even real haha. But if it is, woah?
    
    
    Could be a fat person. But why not a space suit?
    
    
    ----------------
    
    I don't speak Hebrew, nor have the book lying around, so the translation is from some random website on google. But it will read pretty much the same with all translations
    
    "I looked and there was a whirlwind coming from the north, a great cloud with fire flashing back and forth and brilliant light all around it. In the center of the fire, there was a gleam like amber."
    
    Thats from The Book of Ezekiel ( believe it is from 1:4)
    
    Again its tipsy. Sure, maybe he had some bad mushrooms. "What if" it was true. I doubt an omnipotent god would need to make an introduction like that.An atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
26. •  
      CommentAuthorProletariatTreeHuger
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Again, this "what if" outlook is rather useless unless you can back it up with hard facts. A statue isn't proof of aliens. Art isn't proof of aliens. Unless you want to state that Cubism is proof of alternate dimensions merging with ours.
    It's all just wishful thinking to me.

    I concur: FackelDerAufklärung
27. •  
      CommentAuthorFackelDerAufklärung
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     

    Posted By: SgtVoodooJust because someone commits minor crimes, (Its not like he murdered someone), doesn't mean he doesn't have a brain :P
    
    Well if you've read the books, then there not much of a point in me posting the proof, but heres some (Its not solid, in fact I'll admit, its really tipsy. But you never know)
    
    Gotta look closely at this one
    
    

    
    
    I find it rather ironic that you quoted this image from skeptic.com. Here's the article:
    
    http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/07-04-25/
    
    
    

    
    Could be a fat person. But why not a space suit?
    
    

    
    And why not some weirdo's acid dream? Or why can't it be an exaggerated version of how some people thought inuits look like:
    
    
    
    Or maybe it was just some sort of old Picasso-like artist messing with us.
    
    We just don't know.The fear of death arises from the false belief that in death there is awareness.
28. •  
      CommentAuthorZbych
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Marquess
    I am an alien
    
29. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Haha I didn't read the article on skeptic. And I am not going to waste my time :P
    
    I agree the ones I posted weren't the greatest, its all I could find
    
    If you REALLY want evidence, and you haven't already, read some of Erich Von Danikens stuff. Sure he may be some psycho criminal, but he still presents evidence, including pictures :PAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
30. •  
      CommentAuthorAntinous
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     

    Posted By: SgtVoodooREALLY want evidence, and you haven't already, read some of Erich Von Danikens stuff

    
    There is evidence but that evidence is not concrete and open to speculation. It is weak evidence and can easily be misconstrued. Can you focus on say one point at a time like say the Nazca lines. We speak of this here and discuss it.
    The hardest thing to do is watch the one you love, love someone else.
31. • CommentAuthorFerdinand
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Its a bit insane, and I have been as rational as possible, but this seems like a plausible theory that I have grown fond of recently
    
    "According to certain authors, gods called ancient astronauts or ancient aliens have visited Earth, and this contact is connected with the origins or development of human cultures, technologies, and sci-fi novels. A common variant of the idea include proposals that aliens from most – if not all – sci-fi novels are actually gods, and their technologies were taken as evidence of their alien status."
    
    Now the main reason I find this plausible, Is the fact that so many isolated civilizations coincidently came up with many aliens, some even similar.
    
    I can not explain it as well as Jesus does in his books, but if you think about it, primitive people would have no other explanation for advanced technology.
    
    I read somewhere that during WW2, I think it was the Japanese that ended up flying their planes directly over an island populated by a completely isolated tribe. Turns out the natives saw aliens in these roaring beasts, and ended up buildings "statues" if you will, out of whatever wood/grass they could find, and spent a good amount of time, if not constantly since then, scanning the skies, waiting for the "aliens" to return
    
    There are similar stories about coca cola bottles washing up on shores of islands filled with tribes
    
    So to me, it is completely plausible that if gods ever came to earth, they were mistaken for aliens
    
    In conclusion of that part, many books, texts, even cave drawings of aliens, perfectly describe what most people nowadays would call gods landing haha
    
    ...
    
    But really.Standing in the sun with my heart in my hand
32. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    Thanks for reposting my entire first post with a few words changed.
    
    I doubt anyone would ever look at the top of this page, and if they did, they would want some words changed
    
    *sarcasm fail*An atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
33. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 26th 2010

     
    The Nazca lines have got to be my favorite, other than Easter Island
    
    I've read it could be for ceremonial purposes, some sort of calender, or just art.
    
    I am not going to say aliens did it, but you have to wonder why (and how, although I do not doubt their ingenuity) they did it.
    
    It wouldn't be the hardest thing to do, but why? Maybe they were signs to gods, but actual "gods", instead of extra-terrestrial.
    
    Really, the only thing I know is what they look like. I can't say what they are or aren't, just need to take it or leave it :PAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
34. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010 edited

     
    Archduke
    Before rushing off to consider ET here, there may be more plausible explanations . You may need to do the research yourself if you can afford it by going there and using University Archives just as Eric Von Daniken did. Develop critical thinking skills and think of Fackel, as there are many people who have the ability to analyse information.
    What you do not want is the bull excrement meter to come up in some peoples minds but to find some real hard evidence that really supports your hunch. Even if you do not find what you are looking for you may find much about South American Indian culture. Either way it is a treasure.
    VFXGénéralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
35. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010 edited

     
    Well I am gonna give it up on this topic :P
    
    The kind of proof everyone wants is near impossible. What can I do? The only evidence that would be accepted, is if I brought an extra-terrestrial to your front step, and even then, you would have it dissected haha
    
    Just wanted to see what people thought about it hahaAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
36. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    Archduke
    I guess there are artifacts out there which are wonderful which you could pursue like the battery found in Egypt which suggests that perhaps some of the gold is plated on another metal. The proof you have is not scientific but interesting enough to carry the thread on.Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
37. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    Well its not MY proof. I am just passing it on from what I read
    
    The Baghdad battery is pretty interesting too.
    
    Like, its not like theres a solid evidence. But there SOO many maybes, its overwhelmingAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
38. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    Archduke
    Being interested in that can get you interested in real fields of science. I loved StarTrek when I was a kid which is why I now work in the fields of physics. I hope we can get superluminal speeds at Warp 9: we won't if we don't do real science though.Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
39. •  
      CommentAuthorFackelDerAufklärung
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     

    Posted By: SgtVoodooWell I am gonna give it up on this topic :P
    
    The kind of proof everyone wants is near impossible. What can I do? The only evidence that would be accepted, is if I brought an extra-terrestrial to your front step, and even then, you would have it dissected haha
    

    
    
    If it was alive and peaceful, I wouldn't. But I must ask you how you wanted us to believe in aliens. On faith!? :)
    
    

    
    Just wanted to see what people thought about it haha

    
    
    And we told you.The fear of death arises from the false belief that in death there is awareness.
40. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    I never wanted you to believe in aliens, theres no benefit to me
    
    

    Posted By: FackelDerAufklärung

    Just wanted to see what people thought about it haha

    
    
    And we told you.

    
    
    Thanks captain obvious
    
    
    Fackel, I am having trouble figuring out whether your just trolling, or you're serious
    -----------
    VFX, I thank you again for your intelligent repliesAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
41. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    Archduke
    I guess there are several kinds of threads here: some are for fun, topics of interest and some are for philosophical discussion: though unlike other more rigid forums there categories are somewhat loosely applied. Fackel is NOT a troll. If anyone wants an honest opinion they will get it from Fackel ( well you will get it whether you want it or not most times :) ) that will be forthcoming. Our idea here is to look under all stones and avenues, seek alternatives and hopefully do not overlook the obvious.
    I see this as a topic of interest which I am interested in even if it is just to view the artifacts and think of Mayan, Aztec and Inca culture: whether the Clovis people were really European: was Atlantis true etc. To dismiss what we do not know or understand fully is a mistake in my opinion. The people of the past were as intelligent as us, so for the sake of sociology, archaeology, history and a host of other disciplines these topics you bring to us are important. This is not only a forum of debate it is also
    a forum of new ideas, sharing values, art music poetry. This is why our loss of posting videos here I find rather disappointing.
    yours
    
    ВеномФангЖGénéralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
42. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010 edited

     
    I completely understand
    
    And I respect his opinions.
    
    But there are ways of giving your honest opinion, and not coming off as an ass :P 'Could at least make an effortAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
43. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: SgtVoodooand still not coming off as an ass

    
    To exist on this forum you must learn to take spoonfuls of concrete and harden up. It is an intellectually rigorous place as well as a lot of fun but try not to take it personally when someone knocks your idea. It happens to us all.Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
44. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    Oh I've had plenty of concrete.
    
    I am not saying it "hurt my feelings" or anything, but there are nicer ways of putting thingsAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
45. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: SgtVoodoobut there are nicer ways of putting things

    
    This is true, but being human we do err from time to time. Anything interesting you find about Ancient Astronauts etc feel free to post here. You may just have an idea, or maybe an interesting book. As perhaps most people are not interested they will ignore this thread anyhow but I will keep an eye out for new ideas photos and so on. Make links to sites etc. By keeping your ideas here you will not be pushing them down anyones throat and they are free to comment or leave your ideas as they see fit.
    Imagine the first Indian that saw the ship of Columbus, he might have been considered a fool as all Indians know you cannot go too far across the water in a small canoe. No matter what the ridiculer's thought at the time, the Spanish still arrived. Thinking outside the square is often a good idea.
    
    

    vƒ><

    Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
46. •  
      CommentAuthorThe Easter Bunny
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    I have gotten into this discussion late (as usual) but it's a nice topic!!
    Is your hypothesis that ancient astronauts visited Earth and were mistaken as gods, possible? .. of course it is possible BUT given the evidence available, it is not probable...
    It is just as likely that ALL UFO sightings are actually "humans" from a time/space, millions of years into Earth's future, who have traveled back in time... this can explain why there are human abductions... it's because they have genetic defects and need genetic material from humans in our current space/time... also can explain why the "little grey men" look essentially human (i.e. 2 eyes, 2 nostrils, 2 arms, 2 legs, a neck etc) and YET they look different.... they have evolved from our current form!!!
    You see, this is also a nice hypothesis (which I just made up from scratch)... it is also just as possible as yours BUT given the evidence (none whatsoever) not very probable!Honesty may be the best policy, but it's important to remember that, by the process of elimination, dishonesty is the second-best policy...
47. • CommentAuthorSgtVoodoo
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010 edited

     
    True.
    
    But there are hundreds of ancient artifacts that... don't belong there. Which isn't proof, but it adds a little big of probabilityAn atheist is a person who believes that the murder of a single little girl— even once in a million years—casts doubt upon the idea of a benevolent God.
48. •  
      CommentAuthorvenomfangx
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     
    Archduke

    Posted By: The Easter Bunnyalso can explain why the "little grey men" look essentially human (i.e. 2 eyes, 2 nostrils, 2 arms, 2 legs, a neck etc) and YET they look different.... they have evolved from our current form!!!
    You see, this is also a nice hypothesis (which I just made up from scratch)

    
    You thought you had come up with this from scratch but this is exactly the hypothesis and the reality of the computer game XCOM: UFO ENEMY UNKNOWN.
    Généralement, les gens qui savant peu parlent becoup, et les gens qui savant beaucoup parlent peu.
49. •  
      CommentAuthorInferno
    • CommentTimeJul 27th 2010

     

    Posted By: venomfangx

    Posted By: The Easter Bunnyalso can explain why the "little grey men" look essentially human (i.e. 2 eyes, 2 nostrils, 2 arms, 2 legs, a neck etc) and YET they look different.... they have evolved from our current form!!!
    You see, this is also a nice hypothesis (which I just made up from scratch)

    
    You thought you had come up with this from scratch but this is exactly the hypothesis and the reality of the computer game XCOM: UFO ENEMY UNKNOWN.
    La parfaite valeur est de faire sans témoin ce qu'on serait capable de faire devant tout le monde.

    
    
    It also appears in one of the "goosebump" books. Thanks for reminding me, haven't read them in ages. :)The Cosmos is all that is or ever was or ever will be. -Carl Sagan
50. •  
      CommentAuthorFackelDerAufklärung
    • CommentTimeJul 28th 2010

     

    Posted By: SgtVoodooI never wanted you to believe in aliens, theres no benefit to me
    

    
    
    You wanted to propose the speculation that humanoid extraterrestrial aliens were perceived to be gods in the dawn of humankind as something that it is not: a valid scientific theory. And even though you qualified that it is not "EXACTLY science", you are proposing it nonetheless.
    
    And even though it is a funny thing to ponder about for a few minutes, we won't gain much from it. Well, except for movies/TV-shows like Stargate, in which alien gods are part of the whole premise. It's still bullshit of course, but bullshit that can be fun to watch from times to times. (Those soul-eaters of Stargate Atlantis were just silly though. I could never get into Atlantis because of them. Too much suspension of disbelief needed.)
    
    

    
    

    
    Posted By: FackelDerAufklärung

    Just wanted to see what people thought about it haha

    
    And we told you.

    
    Thanks captain obvious
    

    
    Anytime.
    
    

    
    Fackel, I am having trouble figuring out whether your just trolling, or you're serious

    
    
    I. Am. Serious!
    
    

    Posted By: SgtVoodoo
    there are ways of giving your honest opinion, and not coming off as an ass :P 'Could at least make an effort

    
    
    I do not intend to come across as an ass. I do not know though how you read my text though. Let's just say there is is something lost due the medium.
    
    And to to clarify, let me add that almost a decade ago I was a bit more like you. When I first got myself a copy of Däniken from my local library I was fourteen years old, and his book, I don't know which exactly, truly impressed me at first sight. I thought it would be cool if he was right.
    
    Yet if you examine his methods, his proclaimed evidence, you soon would realize: There just is nothing to it. He really just is a hoax, a fraud, a trickster. And that he sells millions of books with his pseudoscience is what makes me feel really offended.
    
    He earned his entry in the Encyclopedia of Claims, Frauds, and Hoaxes of the Occult and Supernatural of James Randi: http://www.randi.org/encyclopedia/Von%20Daniken,%20Erich.html
    
    This whole incident should teach you one thing: Be more skeptic by default when presented with speculation, or strange claims. Especially if you like the speculation at hand. Remind yourself: "It could be wrong. It could be wrong. It could be wrong."
    
    I want peaceful humanoid aliens that can reach our planet to exist, yet I have to realize that the evidence suggests that I shouldn't get my hopes too high. Even if I assume millions of alien civilizations that are like us to exist, the space separating us is far too wide than to assume that any of those species had developed some kind of practical technology to reach us. The nearest galaxy is 26093 lightyears(!) away. So all the billion of other galaxies out there are out of the question of reaching us. They wouldn't even know that we exist in the first place. And keep it mind that the space between each galaxy gets bigger.
    
    So all the aliens to reach us would would have to come from our galaxy, and even there only a small zone is thinkable. To establish some sort of practical travel, anything above a few lightyears would be insane. Who am I kidding. Anything beyond a few lightminutes is practically undoable without entering the realm of (science) FICTION (wormholes, warp drive, Einstein-was-wrong-approach, etc. pp.)
    
    So what do we have in our nearest distance? Well, Mars and Venus. And both missed the habitable zone, so I can tell you: Don't expect any alien visitors any time soon. And I highly doubt that we had some of them in the past. Unless you could prove it of course.
    
    

    Posted By: SgtVoodoo
    Well its not MY proof. I am just passing it on from what I read
    

    
    It doesn't really matter if you support that theory based on your own evidence, or by proxy. I too base much of what I assume to be true on the work of other people. Yet be careful that those guy are actually trustworthy.
    
    

    
    Like, its not like theres a solid evidence. But there SOO many maybes, its overwhelming

    
    Well, you can drown yourself in the possibilities.
    
    I take one tiny piece of extraordinary evidence over your overwhelming maybes anytime. And I advise that you do the same.
    
    

    Posted By: venomfangxThinking outside the square is often a good idea.

    
    Unless you think too far outside the square -- then you might stumble into fantasy-land.The fear of death arises from the false belief that in death there is awareness.